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. >> steve schwartzman steve bechtel. these are guys worth billions that don't want to pay a penny more in taxes and they have the money to help retaliate against republicans who break the pledge. historically, they have funded primary challenges, ads to push the republicans to the far right on this issue. >> jennifer: okay so americans for tax reform has a pac and that's what they give to. those two billionaires. >> trade association technically but it operates as a pac because they buy ads and do a lot of the electioneering stuff that a pac would do. >> jennifer: while he's raising money from his allies, from these two donors and others, i'm sure. 66% tells you. he's also essentially lobbying for tax breaks for entities like general electric. >> that's right. you know, everyone talks about the first part of the norquist pledge, not to raise the tax rates but the second half of it is basically a promise not to cut tax credits which as you know, many of them amount to nothing more than corporate subsidies so g.e. pays nor
. >> steve schwartzman steve bechtel. these are guys worth billions that don't want to pay a penny more in taxes and they have the money to help retaliate against republicans who break the pledge. historically, they have funded primary challenges, ads to push the republicans to the far right on this issue. >> jennifer: okay so americans for tax reform has a pac and that's what they give to. those two billionaires. >> trade association technically but it operates as a pac...
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keeping our troops in iraq and afghanistan indefinitely but making stuff up to prove his point, as steve bennett points out. obama never said the united states overreacted to 9/11 or did he apologize for our actions. >> 9/11 was an enormous trauma to our country. the fear and anger it provoked was understandable. but in some cases it led us to act contrary to our traditions and our ideas. >> dick cheney is up to his old tricks, still lobbying for endless war and lying to make his case. i'm joined by colonel lawrence wilkerson, former chief of staff at the state department and a visiting professor of government and public policy at the college of william and mary. it is amazing that dick cheney's view of the middle east hasn't changed a bit. does that surprise you? >> it doesn't surprise me. i would have thought he would have grown a little in wisdom since that time. one of the reasons the middle east is hostile to u.s. interests today is because we invaded iraq. >> he thinks we should still be there. what is your response? >> he thinks we should be there because he believes we should be
keeping our troops in iraq and afghanistan indefinitely but making stuff up to prove his point, as steve bennett points out. obama never said the united states overreacted to 9/11 or did he apologize for our actions. >> 9/11 was an enormous trauma to our country. the fear and anger it provoked was understandable. but in some cases it led us to act contrary to our traditions and our ideas. >> dick cheney is up to his old tricks, still lobbying for endless war and lying to make his...
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let's start with steve rattner? >> i learned richard haass thinks north korea is the thing we should be lying about thinking about. >> wants us talking about it three hours a day. >> three hours a day. man's on a mission. what did you learn? >> i learned there's yet another reason not to drink soda. >> what is that? >> like i need one. it has some strange flame retardant in it. >> i thought that was gatorade. >> orange soda, snaple drinks. >> what time is it? >> it's "morning joe." chuck todd is straight ahead. >> the people have spoken and they want a deal. brand new poll numbers show us the country is craving a compromise. and guess whose personal ratings are topping the charts? not the president. 2016 sure looks good for the clintons, even though hillary clinton assures us she's not thi running, right now. good morning from washington. it's thursday, december 13, 2012. this is "the daily rundown," i'm chuck todd. the only reason we can't saturday fiscal cliff negotiations have fallen apart is that the two sides a
let's start with steve rattner? >> i learned richard haass thinks north korea is the thing we should be lying about thinking about. >> wants us talking about it three hours a day. >> three hours a day. man's on a mission. what did you learn? >> i learned there's yet another reason not to drink soda. >> what is that? >> like i need one. it has some strange flame retardant in it. >> i thought that was gatorade. >> orange soda, snaple drinks....
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>> steve: yeah. the good news is she was recently cleared of all allegations that she steered bailout money to a bank that her husband had stock in. so terrific. >> gretchen: here is a hypocrisy alert. michael moore, he's the maker of a lot of different films. he got over $840,000 in taxpayer funded incentives to make his movie. but guess who it was about. it was about opposing taxpayer funded incentive for businesses. so some people might find that hypocritical. >> steve: he made a documentary called "capitalism". i get the idea of tax credits for companies that create jobs. how many jobs do you think this michael moore movie created. >> brian: you see his movies really, since the bush one, have really tanked since, have not gotten the traction and he's pretty much disappeared, which i think is a good thing. >> steve: you think so? anyway, speaking of disappeared, whole bunch of michigan's money, $841,145 in taxpayer funded incentives disappeared into the making of that fine motion picture. >> gretc
>> steve: yeah. the good news is she was recently cleared of all allegations that she steered bailout money to a bank that her husband had stock in. so terrific. >> gretchen: here is a hypocrisy alert. michael moore, he's the maker of a lot of different films. he got over $840,000 in taxpayer funded incentives to make his movie. but guess who it was about. it was about opposing taxpayer funded incentive for businesses. so some people might find that hypocritical. >> steve: he...
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steve latourette said some people who call me, they're more worried about the fiscal cliff than about rates going up a couple of points. thomas rooney in your party, if there is truly entitlement reforms that's going to preserve social security and medicare for generations to come, it's going to be very difficult for me to oppose higher rates for the rich. what about that? >> and to mr. rooney's point, if in fact there were fundamental, significant reform of medicare, medicaid and social security so that we in fact save and strengthen and secure those programs, just like we did in our budget,those were included in the president's proposal, then that's something that we would talk about and very seriously consider because there's where we got to get. we got to get real solutions. the problem with the president's proposal is it's not a real solution, it's all politics. >> congressman tom price, thank you for coming on the program. >> we've been talking about the president's advantage right now. so, karl rove was not about to sit on the sidelines. his crossroads gps is running a spot tod
steve latourette said some people who call me, they're more worried about the fiscal cliff than about rates going up a couple of points. thomas rooney in your party, if there is truly entitlement reforms that's going to preserve social security and medicare for generations to come, it's going to be very difficult for me to oppose higher rates for the rich. what about that? >> and to mr. rooney's point, if in fact there were fundamental, significant reform of medicare, medicaid and social...
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. >> and then larry, later in the afternoon, our steve leishman sat down with treasury secretary tim geithner. geithner in that interview late in the afternoon made it clear that this is brinksmanship of the highest order. >> i want to understand the administration's position when it comes to raising taxes on the wealthy. those making more than $250,000. if republicans do not agree to that, is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> oh, absolutely. there's no prospect for an agreement that doesn't involve those rates going up on the top 2% of the wealthy. it's only 2%. >> reporter: of course, up on capitol hill, republicans don't necessarily agree with that. speaker of the house john boehner said today that he is still waiting for a counterproposal now from the president of the united states. and we learned late this afternoon that in fact speaker boehner and president obama had a phone call today. we don't know, however, what was said in that call. but reports are that some progress is being made in these negotiations. at least conversations continuing behind the
. >> and then larry, later in the afternoon, our steve leishman sat down with treasury secretary tim geithner. geithner in that interview late in the afternoon made it clear that this is brinksmanship of the highest order. >> i want to understand the administration's position when it comes to raising taxes on the wealthy. those making more than $250,000. if republicans do not agree to that, is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff? >> oh, absolutely. there's...
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steve jobs or ashton kutcher? we're getting a first look at the film. [ female announcer ] a classic meatloaf recipe from stouffer's starts with ground beef, unions, and peppers baked in a ketchup glaze with savory gravy and mashed russet potatoes. what makes stouffer's meatloaf best of all? that moment you enjoy it at home. stouffer's. let's fix dinner. bp has paid overthe people of bp twenty-threeitment to the gulf. billion dollars that moment you enjoy it at home. to help those affected and to cover cleanup costs. today, the beaches and gulf are open, and many areas are reporting their best tourism seasons in years. and bp's also committed to america. we support nearly 250,000 jobs and invest more here than anywhere else. we're working to fuel america for generations to come. our commitment has never been stronger. >>> we're getting our first look at ashton kutcher as steve jobs this morning. here is cnn's michelle turner. >> we can share the first image from the film which stars ashton kutcher behind the legen
steve jobs or ashton kutcher? we're getting a first look at the film. [ female announcer ] a classic meatloaf recipe from stouffer's starts with ground beef, unions, and peppers baked in a ketchup glaze with savory gravy and mashed russet potatoes. what makes stouffer's meatloaf best of all? that moment you enjoy it at home. stouffer's. let's fix dinner. bp has paid overthe people of bp twenty-threeitment to the gulf. billion dollars that moment you enjoy it at home. to help those affected and...
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dennis kucinich, betty sutton and steve augsrya. i want to thank steve latourette for his leadership and guidance in congress. i have had a privilege to working with my colleagues in support of our fellow buckeyes and americans. their service will not end with this congress. their innovative ideas and selfless service will be felt long after they leave the people's house. i look forward to their future roles as ohioans committed to advancing the interests of our communities, our state and our great country. mr. speaker, i yield back the balance of my time. the speaker pro tempore: the gentleman yields back. the chair recognizes the gentlelady from california, the minority leader, ms. pelosi, for five minutes. ms. pells: thank you very much, mr. speaker. i -- ms. pelosi: thank you very much, mr. speaker. i'm glad that our speaker has brought the fiscal challenges to this floor. it's been long overdue. we have been calling on the speaker to bring forth middle-income tax cut now for a very long time. in fact, since last summer when it
dennis kucinich, betty sutton and steve augsrya. i want to thank steve latourette for his leadership and guidance in congress. i have had a privilege to working with my colleagues in support of our fellow buckeyes and americans. their service will not end with this congress. their innovative ideas and selfless service will be felt long after they leave the people's house. i look forward to their future roles as ohioans committed to advancing the interests of our communities, our state and our...
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. >> congressman steve from new york and chairman of the democratic congressional campaign committee. good afternoon, sir. >> hi, martin. >> congressman, notwithstanding the fact that speaker boehner's office is considered mathematically dyslexic by many economists, has it surprised you some republicans have actually condemned boehner's office and would much prefer to keep taxes as they are and take an axe to social programs, medicare, in order to reduce the deficit? >> what's to surprising about that? for so many republicans, they said in the 1990s they wanted medicare to wither on the vine. you know, they now think they have the opportunity to do it in 2012. speaker boehner's proposal is based on the mathematical equation, two plus two equals whatever you want it to be. that's not how you grow the middle class. you do it in a balanced way. let's reduce the deficit we've already supported, $2 trillion in spending cuts, but let's do it in a way by asking the richest 2% to do their fair and grow the economy by making smart investments and things like job creating infrastructure. that'
. >> congressman steve from new york and chairman of the democratic congressional campaign committee. good afternoon, sir. >> hi, martin. >> congressman, notwithstanding the fact that speaker boehner's office is considered mathematically dyslexic by many economists, has it surprised you some republicans have actually condemned boehner's office and would much prefer to keep taxes as they are and take an axe to social programs, medicare, in order to reduce the deficit? >>...
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jenna: steve, thank you. gregg: a shocking real-life health crisis involving a former child star, why frankie m u.n. iz was rushed to the hospital. we are live at the breaking news desk. the new nears about chemical weapons in the civil war rocking syria, why the u.s. and the international community should be concerned. we'll go in-depth with ambassador bolton. jenna: right now we are learning about a serious health problem for a former child star, rick folbaum is live at the breaking news news desk with more. >> reporter: you don't usually hear about healthy 20 somethings having strokes. that's what doctors say happened to frankly m u.n. is. he was riding his motorcycle in phoenix when he lost vision in one eye. friends, including his fiancee got worried when he was acting very strangely. turns out he was having a mini stroke. here he is on "good morning america." >> something wasn't right. i knew i did not feel right. coy -pbt say words. couldn't say words. i thought i was saying them. my fiancee was lookin
jenna: steve, thank you. gregg: a shocking real-life health crisis involving a former child star, why frankie m u.n. iz was rushed to the hospital. we are live at the breaking news desk. the new nears about chemical weapons in the civil war rocking syria, why the u.s. and the international community should be concerned. we'll go in-depth with ambassador bolton. jenna: right now we are learning about a serious health problem for a former child star, rick folbaum is live at the breaking news news...
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with us on set, economic analyst steve rattner. also political editor and white house correspondent for the huffington post, sam stein. andrea mitchell. and in new york, msnbc contributor, mike barnicle. and the co-anchor of "street signs," brian sullivan. we've got a lot to talk about, mike barnicle, but i saw a headline on the front page of "usa today," a tease that is very intriguing, and that is one of the greatest players in major league baseball trying to get his worth right now. and if i were a major league team, i would pass on josh hamilton in a new york second because the guy phoned it in when his team needed him the most. there's an attitude problem. and yet he could be such a huge payoff. are the red sox looking at josh hamilton? >> i think any team that's looking at hamilton is looking at no longer than three years with him because of the things you just mentioned. >> he, of course, had an addiction problem, a terrible addiction problem. he got passed -- it was an inspiring story, but he seemed to fall off the cliff. n
with us on set, economic analyst steve rattner. also political editor and white house correspondent for the huffington post, sam stein. andrea mitchell. and in new york, msnbc contributor, mike barnicle. and the co-anchor of "street signs," brian sullivan. we've got a lot to talk about, mike barnicle, but i saw a headline on the front page of "usa today," a tease that is very intriguing, and that is one of the greatest players in major league baseball trying to get his worth...
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. >>> and ashton kutcher has steve jobs. we have the first official picture from the set of the much anticipated movie. take a look at it right there. they look-alike, don't they? when you put those pictures side by side it's pretty amazing. we'll have the full story coming up. welcome back to "early start." i'm zoraida sambolin. >> and i'm christine romans in for john berman. there are new faces of the republican party, florida senator marco rubio and congressman paul ryan of wisconsin appearing together last night at the jack kemp foundation awards dinner in washington, trying to rebrand themselves and their party after a bruising setback in november. cnn political editor paul steinhauser live from washington this morning. paul ryan got hammered during the election. is he dialing back the rhetoric now? >> this was ryan's first speech since the election. both he and rubio seemed to be talking about how the republican party needs to be a party that's more inclusive, helping those in the lower associatio economic levels to ri
. >>> and ashton kutcher has steve jobs. we have the first official picture from the set of the much anticipated movie. take a look at it right there. they look-alike, don't they? when you put those pictures side by side it's pretty amazing. we'll have the full story coming up. welcome back to "early start." i'm zoraida sambolin. >> and i'm christine romans in for john berman. there are new faces of the republican party, florida senator marco rubio and congressman paul...
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steve said it best from the outset. if the president does not get off to the right start here, it makes it incredibly difficult, if not at a minimum, complicated, to get the rest of his agenda through, not to mention all the foreign policy challenges that will be the backdrop. steve indicated this is the most important thing that will be done. he's likely right unless there's something that we don't want to at all think about or foresee for the next few years, so you have to get this right or get it done to get to the next step. >> but on the specifics of it, steve, why should we be optimistic? who's going to move from their position, and why would they? >> the reasons to be optimistic, you have two prose prose propos table that are robust. the president's made important concessions on revenues. the democrats have made concessions on addressing entitlements, not insufficient for the other one, and what we're fighting over now is this issue of tax rates. and the republicans do have to give on tax rates. it's going to be
steve said it best from the outset. if the president does not get off to the right start here, it makes it incredibly difficult, if not at a minimum, complicated, to get the rest of his agenda through, not to mention all the foreign policy challenges that will be the backdrop. steve indicated this is the most important thing that will be done. he's likely right unless there's something that we don't want to at all think about or foresee for the next few years, so you have to get this right or...
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can ashton kutcher live up to the steve jobs' legacy? you're watching "starting point." we're back in just a moment. whem another company to us, we even reward you for the time you spent there. genius. yeah, genius. you guys must have your own loyalty program, right? well, we have something. show her, tom. huh? you should see november! oh, yeah? point," constantly surrounded by point." sse. call or click today. [ male announcer ] the way it moves. the way it cleans. everything about the oral-b power brush is simply revolutionary. oral-b power brushes oscillate, rotate and even pulsate to gently loosen and break up that sticky plaque with more brush movements than manual brushes and even up to 50% more than leading sonic technology brushes for a superior clean. oral-b power brushes. go to oralb.com for the latest offers. home of the legendary grand prix circuit. the perfect place to bring the all-new cadillac ats to test the 2.0-liter turbo engine. [ engine revs ] ♪ [ derek ] 272 horsepower. the lightest in its class. the cadillac ats outmatches the bmw 3 series. i cann
can ashton kutcher live up to the steve jobs' legacy? you're watching "starting point." we're back in just a moment. whem another company to us, we even reward you for the time you spent there. genius. yeah, genius. you guys must have your own loyalty program, right? well, we have something. show her, tom. huh? you should see november! oh, yeah? point," constantly surrounded by point." sse. call or click today. [ male announcer ] the way it moves. the way it cleans....
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host: steve in massachusetts, democratic caller. caller: the home and that was just talking, i disagree with her as far as a drop in the bucket, when you look at curbing government pay. when you guys talk about the areas that get cut, the military spending, discretionary spending, and entitlements, what i want to hear in addition to that is government waste and fraud. when you talk about entitlements, you hear a lot of people argue about public waste and fraud. government waste and fraud, i think the later referred to it as instances. the gsa had a great deal of money being improperly spent. senator tom coburn has talked about redundancy in programs, senators and congressmen not looking back to see if there is a matrix in place and to see if they're actually working so that nonperforming programs -- host: let's get a response, because we're running out of time. guest: once again, i cannot emphasize enough that i am very much in favor of eliminating fraud and waste and inefficiency. it is hard to do. i don't agree with you that we ar
host: steve in massachusetts, democratic caller. caller: the home and that was just talking, i disagree with her as far as a drop in the bucket, when you look at curbing government pay. when you guys talk about the areas that get cut, the military spending, discretionary spending, and entitlements, what i want to hear in addition to that is government waste and fraud. when you talk about entitlements, you hear a lot of people argue about public waste and fraud. government waste and fraud, i...
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joining me now from washington, congressman steve israel, democrat of new york. congressman, nice to see you back here on the show. >> thanks, brooke. >> i understand you, yourself, have been reaching out to some of the house republicans on this. have you spoken to any of them? >> i have. and you're right, it is tough for a republican to break with his or her party and sign this petition to give a tax cut to 100% of all americans on the first $250,000. what's tougher, i think, is for them to go home and have to explain to people who are making $100,000, $200,000 that they're not going to get a tax break, that their taxes are going to go up $2,000 in order to protect the richest 2%. now, look, i personally believe that that $250,000 figure is too low. if you represent a high cost of living area like mine, i think it should be higher. but i'm not willing to go back to long island and explain to somebody who is making less than $250,000 that they're going to be held hostage for people making more. agree on the 250 and get to the higher number. >> the republican as y
joining me now from washington, congressman steve israel, democrat of new york. congressman, nice to see you back here on the show. >> thanks, brooke. >> i understand you, yourself, have been reaching out to some of the house republicans on this. have you spoken to any of them? >> i have. and you're right, it is tough for a republican to break with his or her party and sign this petition to give a tax cut to 100% of all americans on the first $250,000. what's tougher, i think,...
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. >> steve: if you would like more information about petra's great work with happy hearts, go to clinique.com. >> brian: tomorrow, michelle mal con and mike tyson. >> gretchen: see you tomorrow. bill: 9:00 a.m. good morning. egypt's president under siege after 100,000 protest in the streets. here is your update. president maury * is back in the presidential palace after running from tens of thousands protesting outside the protest. hosni mubarak was forced out of this same palace two years ago. it's difficult to say which way this story is going to go. it has huge implications. martha: you see these protesters furious for morsi's power grab and his rushing through a new constitution drafted by his muslim brotherhood allies. many fear if it's adhered to it could turn egypt into an islamic state. bill: how close did the protesters get to the president? >> reporter: the protesters got right to the walls of the presidential compound. it's the first time we saw them move from tahrir square. they broke through the walls protecting the compound. the protesters did not try to scale the walls of that
. >> steve: if you would like more information about petra's great work with happy hearts, go to clinique.com. >> brian: tomorrow, michelle mal con and mike tyson. >> gretchen: see you tomorrow. bill: 9:00 a.m. good morning. egypt's president under siege after 100,000 protest in the streets. here is your update. president maury * is back in the presidential palace after running from tens of thousands protesting outside the protest. hosni mubarak was forced out of this same...
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steve doocy. >> europe is great because they have wonderful food and runny cheeses, but we shouldn't base our policies on theirs because they are stinkers. >> we should base it on singapore where they have no unemployment, and they have a competitive market. that protects workers. >> stephanie: we should be like singapore? >> oh my god. holy crap. he is a bigger idiot than i thought. he is not even trying to hide what a douche bag he is. >> stephanie: okay. bill o'reilly. really? is this his whole december? >> there is no doubt that your day you christian tradition in this country is under attack. and people like pastor happy have not to stop. okay. enough. enough. and we need leadership not only in the pulpit but now we are going to need it in the public square. >> after of the judao christian are jewish. you moron. >> stephanie: thank you for that reference. [ applause ] >> stephanie: judao, christian. >> i'm an atheist, i don't care if you have a cross on your property -- i really don't. this whole thing is just completely made up. >> stephanie: i don't get any of it. i never have
steve doocy. >> europe is great because they have wonderful food and runny cheeses, but we shouldn't base our policies on theirs because they are stinkers. >> we should base it on singapore where they have no unemployment, and they have a competitive market. that protects workers. >> stephanie: we should be like singapore? >> oh my god. holy crap. he is a bigger idiot than i thought. he is not even trying to hide what a douche bag he is. >> stephanie: okay. bill...
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steve scalise, a congressman from louisiana, recently elected as the leader of the republican study committee for the next congress. i yield to the gentleman from louisiana. mr. scalise: i thank the gentlelady for her leadership, not only for hosting this hour but for being so passionate about the need to control spending, and the need to get the economy back on track. she was talking about about solutions to avert the fiscal cliff. if if you look at how we got here, nothing gets resolved out of washington, it's an abyss that doesn't need to happen. if you just go back and look at the promises made by poth because massachusetts when he was running for office, when he was running for re-election, he talked about working across the aisle he talked about bipartisan solutions he talked about it a lot and the american people expected that the president would keep that promise. but before the ink was even dry, before some of the states had confirmed and finalized their vote totals for this last election, the president comes out with a hyper partisan solution that's his approach. when the president
steve scalise, a congressman from louisiana, recently elected as the leader of the republican study committee for the next congress. i yield to the gentleman from louisiana. mr. scalise: i thank the gentlelady for her leadership, not only for hosting this hour but for being so passionate about the need to control spending, and the need to get the economy back on track. she was talking about about solutions to avert the fiscal cliff. if if you look at how we got here, nothing gets resolved out...
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. >> eric: the reality is, we have a spending problem, steve. how much money we're actually taxing, tax revenues are going up. >> they have to. >> eric: it's a spending issue. if we're putting a trillion dollars into the deficit you can't fix that with taxes. >> no, you sure can't. eric, when i first came to washington, which was about 25 years ago, we barely had a trillion dollar budget and here we are, 25 years later and we're closing in on a 4 trillion dollar budget and that under democrats and republicans as well and there haven't been serious cuts in spending in this town in at least 10 or 15 years and i'm kind of frustrated that neither party is really serious about getting these spending programs under control. i mean, we have been-- you look at entitlement programs and president obama and a lot of democrats say we can't cut medicare, social security, medicaid. and that's half the budget there. of course, we're spending 600, 700 billion dollars a year just to pay the interest on the debt. just on the interest. so you don't get any return
. >> eric: the reality is, we have a spending problem, steve. how much money we're actually taxing, tax revenues are going up. >> they have to. >> eric: it's a spending issue. if we're putting a trillion dollars into the deficit you can't fix that with taxes. >> no, you sure can't. eric, when i first came to washington, which was about 25 years ago, we barely had a trillion dollar budget and here we are, 25 years later and we're closing in on a 4 trillion dollar budget...
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basically have everything you've accomplished at alabama wiped off the map because the end will be -- steve spurrier still hasn't recovered from his stint in washington. the guy was a football god. he went to washington and immediately the stories started, you know, that this guy was bush league. he was a college coach. if saban goes up and fails a second time -- and god bless him, he's done enough for alabama, he deserves that right, or do you want to be remembered the greatest college football coach of all time? he sticks around another ten years, wins more champion sshi people consider this guy the john wooden of college football. >> when you look at what they've done p college coaches, that could be the lure, but he was miserable when he was at miami. in his second year with the dolphins, he was looking for opportunities back at the college game. i think it would take a lot to get him back to the nfl. when you look at all the teams that will need coaches -- >> but why go? >> well, money. a lot of money. a whole lot of money. >> in the words of dire straits, he's got a daytime job. he's
basically have everything you've accomplished at alabama wiped off the map because the end will be -- steve spurrier still hasn't recovered from his stint in washington. the guy was a football god. he went to washington and immediately the stories started, you know, that this guy was bush league. he was a college coach. if saban goes up and fails a second time -- and god bless him, he's done enough for alabama, he deserves that right, or do you want to be remembered the greatest college...